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* ILGOP yesterday…
In a press conference this morning, the Illinois Republican Party announced they have filed a federal lawsuit against Governor JB Pritzker for his violations of the First Amendment. In recent weeks, the Governor has selectively endorsed and participated in large scale rallies and gatherings of thousands of individuals not practicing social distancing. Meanwhile, his COVID-19 executive orders ban Illinois Republicans, and other groups, from gathering in groups larger than 10 people.
“Governor Pritzker is ruling Illinois like an unaccountable king where only he gets to decide which violations of his executive order have his blessing. The Illinois Republican Party will not sit idly by while the Governor of Illinois applies one rule for himself and his political allies and another rule for everyone else. We agree that peaceful protesters have just cause to exercise their first amendment rights, but they aren’t the only ones. The days of Governor Pritzker picking winners and losers is coming to an end. The hypocrisy has to end. The violation of our First Amendment rights has to end.” - ILGOP Chairman Tim Schneider
This past week, the Illinois Republican Party was forced to hold its’ quadrennial convention virtually, eliminating in-person collaboration, networking, and training. The 2020 general election is five months away and the only opposition to Pritzker and Illinois Democrats’ control is indefinitely barred from meeting for normal party functions.
This isn’t the first time Governor Pritzker has played by a different set of rules. When restrictions barred travel to vacation homes and the Governor lectured Illinoisans daily about not crossing state borders, Pritzker’s family was traveling to and from their equestrian estates in Florida and Wisconsin. And now, we see Pritzker continue to restrict funerals, weddings, festivals, youth sports - and political gatherings - at the same time he marches with thousands of protesters on a crowded street.
The lawsuit was filed yesterday in the U.S. District Court for the Northern District of Illinois. The Illinois Republican Party will be represented by the Liberty Justice Center.
* From the lawsuit…
Political parties are for political expression what churches are for religious expression: the corporate manifestation of speech and interaction within a community of shared belief. Political parties’ events and rallies are also like protest rallies and marches. And like churches and marches, political parties operate in a world where time matters; the 2020 election is only months away. Also similarly, they operate best in a physical setting; in-person contact is the most persuasive form for communicating ideas.
Yet, unlike churches, political parties are barred from gathering in groups greater than 10 under the Governor’s Executive Order 2020-38. And unlike protestors against police brutality, they have not been given an exemption based on his sympathy, recognition, and participation. This disparate treatment of similar expressive activities violates both the First and 14th Amendments.
* Public Radio…
“This is about scoring political points and criticizing civil rights protests supporting the Black Lives Matter movement. The courts have repeatedly upheld the Governor’s executive orders as based on public health guidance. And as the Republicans who attended protests against the public health guidance are well aware, the State has never prevented people from exercising their First Amendment rights” said Jordan Abudayyeh, the Governor’s Press Secretary, in a statement. […]
Mary Morrissey, Executive Director of the Democratic Party of Illinois:
“We recall large groups of Republicans freely gathering at the Capitol and in downtown Chicago to protest Governor Pritzker’s handling of how to reopen the state without legal ramifications. This lawsuit is a distraction from the real issue — a Republican president who the IL GOP considers the ‘man of our time,’ but has let over a hundred thousand Americans die because of his inaction. We support Governor Pritzker and the exemplary leadership he’s shown throughout this public health crisis,” said a prepared statement, from Mary Morrisey, Executive Director of the Democratic Party of Illinois.
* The ILGOP is also fundraising off the issue…
As you can imagine…suing a billionaire governor is expensive. We’re expecting Governor Pritzker will throw whatever he needs at this battle to silence it. But we won’t stop fighting, especially if we have you behind us.
Can you chip in $5, $10, $20 or whatever you can afford to our official Sue JB Pritzker Fund?
We’re relying on donations from supporters throughout the state to break through this case and bring justice to our state.
Don’t sit this one out. This is big time.
The attorney general handles lawsuits like this one.
*** UPDATE *** The 7th US Circuit Court of Appeals yesterday ruled against a church which wanted to prevent Gov. Pritzker from ever reimposing his 10-person limit on church service attendance. From that opinion…
Feeding the body requires teams of people to work together in physical spaces, but churches can feed the spirit in other ways.
As can political parties.
posted by Rich Miller
Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 9:35 am
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===The ILGOP is also fundraising off the issue===
Honest question.
When will these lawsuits be determined to be vexatious litigation.
The GOP is clearly abusing the court system for its own fundraising purposes, and isn’t at all interested in the outcome of the case.
That’s almost a textbook example of a vexatious litigant.
Comment by TheInvisibleMan Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 9:39 am
They were assigned to Judge Ellis. Good luck with that argument.
Comment by Anon E Moose Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 9:39 am
My first question is…
How many GOP legislators or elected officials took it upon themselves to march in favor of Black Lives Matter?
Was Tim Schneider marching and supporting Black Lives Matter?
Why or why not?
If this suit is about the freedom to express ones self, I guess the choices of the GOP to think they should sue to worship but be absent from the marches only highlights more and more the thinking of race in the ILGOP?
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 9:41 am
Didn’t I just read that an appeals court ruled in favor of Pritzker regarding church services. Another political stunt by the GOP.
Comment by Norseman Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 9:48 am
A bunch of narrow-minded conservatives want to gather in masses during a pandemic, knowing full well most won’t wear a mask?
Will they be required to sign a waiver?
Comment by efudd Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 9:48 am
=== The Illinois Republican Party will not sit idly by while the Governor of Illinois applies one rule for himself and his political allies and another rule for everyone else. We agree that peaceful protesters have just cause to exercise their first amendment rights, but they aren’t the only ones.===
If I read that correctly, that’s a party that disagrees with the Black Lives Matter protests, but…
“… agree that peaceful protesters have just cause to exercise their first amendment rights, but they aren’t the only ones.”
There it is.
Make NO mistake what the ILGOP is saying here. It’s their words;
“… agree that peaceful protesters have just cause to exercise their first amendment rights, but they aren’t the only ones.”
Exercising the right is fine, they aren’t agreeing with the thought to what is being protested… “but churches”
When Tim Schneider tells you who he is and what he is representing here….
… believe him.
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 9:50 am
Nice to see the Liberty Justice Center representing the IL GOP here. Putting the party back in non-partisan.
They still list Mark Janus as a senior fellow. https://liberty justice center.org/about/
Comment by Henry Francis Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 9:50 am
“The hypocrisy has to end.”
Pritzker didn’t stop the “reopen now” rallies, so no hypocrisy.
“the Governor has selectively endorsed and participated in large scale rallies and gatherings of thousands of individuals not practicing social distancing.”
This is the fight the ILGOP wants to pick, and what sticks in its craw. It really wants to remain the super-minority party. Who is representing the ILGOP? The anti-union Liberty Justice Center of the IPI, who represented Janus. So a unanimous “no” on taxing the rich more, Trumpism and allying with the IPI, that’s the ILGOP.
Comment by Grandson of Man Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 9:55 am
“However [political parties] may now and then answer popular ends, they are likely in the course of time and things, to become potent engines, by which cunning, ambitious, and unprincipled men will be enabled to subvert the power of the people and to usurp for themselves the reins of government, destroying afterwards the very engines which have lifted them to unjust dominion.”
Still true George.
Comment by OurMagician Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 9:55 am
“The ILGOP is also fundraising off the issue…”
That’s the real issue here.
Comment by Just Me 2 Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:01 am
This was filed June 15th. If all goes well, and I pray it does, we start Phase 4 on July 1st. Is the point of this lawsuit to say on July 1st when Phase 4 starts and groups of up to 50 people can meet that “look guys, we forced the Governor to further return us to normalcy.” Is that the closest thing they can get to a win? No wonder they allowed themselves to become so irrelevant.
Comment by Nuke The Whales Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:01 am
“If I read that correctly, that’s a party that disagrees with the Black Lives Matter protests, but…”
You are missing the point, the BLM protests went off without any enforcement or condemnation from public health or state officials; this despite the fact that the protests certainly were in violation of the public gathering rules in the JB’s phase 3. And exactly which BLM issues do you think the ILGOP disagrees with?
Comment by Donnie Elgin Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:01 am
==If all goes well, and I pray it does, we start Phase 4 on July 1st.==
I’ve always heard June 26th (tentatively) for the start of Phase 4. Which is 28 days after the start of Phase 3 on May 29.
Comment by Chatham Resident Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:05 am
With respect, I think it is a fair hit. The Governor has said that he participates in the protests because they are important. I agree on the importance, by the way, but he is pulling the old “Do what I say, not what I do” routine.
The GOP rhetoric is a little much here, and they are incorrect about the stay at home order prohibiting interstate travel, and it is a bad move to criticize the Governor’s participation in the rallies without acknowledging their value, but the Governor is picking and choosing what is important enough to break social distancing and what isn’t.
Comment by SAP Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:07 am
Oswego Willy
What about protestors having “just cause” is confusing to you in Schneider’s statement? He is literally saying they have a right, and a good reason to be protesting…
Comment by Southern IL Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:09 am
Again the GOP makes themselves look ridiculous. Churchgoers and registered Republicans are the most likely to pass along covid-19 in mass gatherings. Progressives are thoughtful and social distance.
Comment by Bruce rauner's housekeeper Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:10 am
“unlike churches, political parties are barred from gathering in groups greater than 10″
And unlike political parties, churches are barred from directly or indirectly participating in, or intervening in, any political campaign on behalf of, or in opposition to, any candidate for elective public office.
It’s as if political parties and churches are, and have always been, recognized as very different entities under the laws and constitution of the United States.
– MrJM
Comment by @misterjayem Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:11 am
=== You are missing the point===
Oh, I’m not.
The Black Lives Matter Protest only matter to the ILGOP if churches can be open.
The Black Lives Matter protests are merely a way to try to make worship in large groups possible.
The Black Lives Protest themselves?
===“… The days of Governor Pritzker picking winners and losers is coming to an end. The hypocrisy has to end. The violation of our First Amendment rights has to end.”===
I guess Black Lives Matter protests are losers to the ILGOP winners of attending church?
I got the point.
Had the ILGOP been attending Black Lives Matter protests, then this lawsuit might even make sense.
The only thing Schneider sees is a way to have large group worship… and using Black Lives Matter protests… while not participating… whew… that’s some… well, that’s something.
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:11 am
=== What about protestors having “just cause” is confusing to you in Schneider’s statement? ===
If it is such a “just cause”, why isn’t the ILGOP participating?
I guess the ILGOP is picking “winners and losers” too?
Please, stop digging.
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:13 am
This… specifically alone.
=== He is literally saying they have a right, and a good reason to be protesting…===
The ILGOP said no such thing.
The ILGOP said;
=== We agree that peaceful protesters have just cause to exercise their first amendment rights, but they aren’t the only ones.===
“… exercise their…”
I guess the ILGOP doesn’t see the need for protests.
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:16 am
How ironic that this is coming from the party that loves to hate on frivolous lawsuits
Comment by Shytown Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:21 am
Well, I will say this, during my time involved with the GOP in this state there were at the time, especially near the end, there points where I was praying during meetings to myself, just like I do at church.
When I went to one of the last meetings I ever went to (it was after having not gone in quite some time), and I saw all the MAGA hats (it was primary season 2016), I did think of teaching about false profits.
Finally, much like a church service, a GOP meeting isn’t a great place to say ‘yeah, but what about…’
So point taken Illinois GOP.
BTW, at the meetings, you going to talk about the President’s opinion about Abraham Lincoln? It seems like, based on his advice, you should rename Lincoln Day.
Comment by OneMan Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:24 am
So, Reopen Illinois rallies don’t count?
Comment by TinyDancer(FKASue) Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:33 am
JB epitomizes the word hypocrite.
Comment by Blue Dog Dem Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:39 am
“As you can imagine…suing a billionaire governor is expensive.”
The ILGOP playing itself as the working man’s party of the middle class after 5 years of being propped up by a handful of billionaires is a sight to see.
Comment by NIU Grad Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:55 am
The GOP is going about this all wrong. They need to hold a “protest” event, like we’ve been seeing for the last few weeks. That way there are no restrictions upon those gathered. Simple
Comment by RuralKing Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:03 am
The only disparate action i can see here is that the Gov chose to go to certain protests and not others. I don’t think that’s going to cut it as “damage” under 1A, but i could be wrong.
Comment by Britta Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:06 am
Just love how the left wants to be the decider of what others should be protesting about. If it’s not their agenda then the left doesn’t agree with the rights of the other side
Comment by Left Center Right Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:16 am
So everyone is upset that the ILGOP didn’t participate in the BLM protests. I’m not sure why this shocks anyone. They are a minority party for many reasons and minority rights is certainly at the top. They will still hold to the law and order mantra while failing to understand the movement of police reform before them.
But, the governor and his democratic allies do have a little hypocritical actions as it relates to protests. Protests to open the economy are bad and they will kill grandma. Protests for BLM and police reform is great and we should all set science aside for a just cause.
I hear it in the streets. The stay at home order is effectively over.
Comment by Nagidam Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:19 am
===If it’s not their agenda then the left doesn’t agree with the rights of the other side===
What protest has the state stopped in the past few months? The “reopeners” have been demonstrating for weeks without interference from the state.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:19 am
Between this and Trump’s Tulsa rally, it’s almost as thought the GOP wanted literally to kill itself off.
Comment by JoanP Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:20 am
=== If it’s not their agenda===
Like I said…
It appears the ILGOP is against BLM… except as an example to have people in a church?
Thanks.
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:23 am
Agree if this gets to the Seventh Circuit that panel can issue a perfunctory ruling saying “What the panel in Elim said. Denied.”
Comment by Ron Burgundy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:25 am
When you’ve ceded your seat at the table all you’re left with is victimhood.
Comment by Pundent Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:26 am
the first amendment doesn’t talk about BLM or church. Only race baiters do.
Comment by Blue Dog Dem Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:26 am
Oh.
Those who were “protesting” against opening up too quickly or “blocking” those demanding things open like businesses?
Nurses and doctors… wearing scrubs.
They can care less about ideology when they’re working 12+ hour shifts, 6 days a week, isolating from family.
No one stopped the “open” protests, we had one in Oswego…
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:29 am
OW
Not trying to be contradictory, but these same Nurses and Doctors that were protesting against the folks that wanted to open up the economy were in solidarity with the BLM/police reform protests. Science be dammed.
Comment by Nagidam Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:32 am
=== Not trying to be contradictory===
You’re not.
If anything, BLM, the “openers” and even the doctors and nurses…
They *all* were protesting, none were denied that right.
This idea, however, to be as the Gospel of Matthew warns, that the hypocrites need to pray publicly, be seen praying, while judges agree with the limits to gather, makes one wonder why the party of Lincoln isn’t on the side of BLM, except to use those protests as a way to open churches.
It’s a head scratcher… but it’s not.
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:37 am
- As can political parties -
I don’t understand, neither the DPI or Gov. Pritzker planned or orchestrated these protests. I assume no state resources were used, even if you believe his actions are hypocritical in participating since when is that a legal argument?
Comment by Excitable Boy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:41 am
OurMagician,
Thanks for Washington’s comment about ‘factions’ i.e. political parties. I have always been amazed about how prescient he was.
Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 11:41 am
Political parties are for political expression what churches are for religious expression: both worshipping at the altar of the all mighty dollar.
Comment by Huh? Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 12:02 pm
- Blue Dog Dem - Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 10:39 am:
JB epitomizes the word hypocrite.
No…he doesn’t…perhaps you will look in the mirror?
Comment by Dotnonymous Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 12:29 pm
So the Left says Do as I say, believe what I believe and do it in the manner of how we say it should be done. LOL
Comment by Wow Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 12:50 pm
=== So the Left says Do as I say, believe what I believe and do it in the manner of how we say it should be done.===
How you typed that without mouth breathing is a miracle, lol
I guess attending church services is a form of protest?
That’s an interesting take.
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 12:53 pm
Rich - No one should have to exercise their rights with uncertainty on if they will be prosecuted for doing so. Sure the Gov won’t stop a protest (but that’s not really what the lawsuit is about) but he could change his mind tomorrow and be legally allowed to disband the gathering. Only the courts can make sure it’s certain he can’t.
Comment by Southern IL Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 12:54 pm
=== Sure the Gov won’t stop a protest (but that’s not really what the lawsuit is about)===
LOL
Then why does Schneider and the ILGOP cite the protest as their rationale to publicly worship?
It’s not like the ILGOP as a whole or Schneider cite their *own* attendance in support of BLM.
=== Only the courts can make sure it’s certain he can’t.===
Heaven forbid we get an activist judge, amirite?
The church guidelines have held up in court too, so there’s that.
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 12:59 pm
But there were no germs spread in the protests, Right Willy??
LOL
Comment by Wow Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:00 pm
=== But there were no germs spread in the protests===
Tell that to the judge(s) around the country that have supported limited worship.
You’re welcome.
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:01 pm
Maybe the churches should have worshippers sign waivers?
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:03 pm
Why not just outlaw sickness. Then if anyone gets sick anywhere for any reason they can sue, since your idea is to live in a bubble
Comment by Wow Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:18 pm
===Only the courts can make sure it’s certain he can’t===
Did you miss the update?
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:19 pm
=== Why not just outlaw sickness===
Argue like an adult, please.
Maybe the mouth breathing has made you light headed?
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:19 pm
Willy with 13 posts here . . . .13.
Perhaps a new self importance record . . . .
Comment by Hey There Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:35 pm
The GOP may be on to something. These days many people are much more passionate about their political party than their religion. It might be time to start classifying all political parties as religions so that we keep up with the new zeitgeist. /s
Comment by Pelonski Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:35 pm
Way to attack Willy. But that’s what the left does when they can’t win the argument
Comment by Wow Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:37 pm
Church gatherings over 50 are bad but protesting in the thousands is good. LOL
Comment by Wow Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:39 pm
=== Way to… ===
Are you still yammering on and on?
The adults are talking, go make getting sick against the law…
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:39 pm
===Church gatherings over 50 are bad===
Says who?
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:39 pm
14
Comment by Hey There Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:40 pm
=== Church gatherings over 50 are bad but protesting in the thousands is good.===
Again, tell that to the 7th US Circuit Court of Appeals
Either keep up, or work on outlawing sickness.
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:40 pm
- Hey There -
Got your shoes and socks off I see…
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:42 pm
Hey There…What O.W. says is important…your comments are irrelevant.
Comment by Dotnonymous Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:45 pm
If it were up to me, I’d make the Dem Convention virtual next month. Its way to risky. The GOP likely should as well but of course they wont.
Its been over 40 years since anything of substance was decided at a convention. They have become like Infomercials.
Comment by low level Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:46 pm
50 limit is phase 4 Rich
Comment by Wow Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:50 pm
===50 limit is phase 4 Rich===
Are you illiterate or just stupid? There are no official limits on religious services.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 1:54 pm
=If JB is allowing protesting gatherings, why does he limit church gatherings??=
This was revised several weeks ago (even though the court upheld the limitation). So you might want to update your talking points.
The only limits that are being placed on religious services are the ones that many religious leaders are placing upon themselves. It seems that the majority of them still don’t believe in endangering the lives of their parishioners by holding in person services during a pandemic.
Comment by Pundent Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 2:02 pm
=== This was revised several weeks ago (even though the court upheld the limitation). So you might want to update your talking points.===
Succinct and spot on.
To all that and the “point”
The court has ruled, the Governor, working with clergy and places of worship found a response to worship.
This “idea” that the ILGOP first cites BLM as a way to hypocrisy AND the misunderstanding of religious expression here in Illinois during the pandemic, and while the courts have sided with the Governor, there is a working understanding to keep all worshiping safe.
It should be quite ironic too… to Mr. Schneider… that waivers are being required in Tulsa for POTUS… see, this virus isn’t anything to mess with, and a sitting POTUS holding an ill-advised rally during that pandemic… well, there needs to be legal cover.
This is a self-own for Schneider and his ILGOP statement, as protests, by all appearances he is not attending or the party not attending either, are the rationale? To even give an appearance of thoughtfulness, Schneider’s own marching and cited as such would be a stronger argument, while now it continues to show how hollow the ILGOP looks to the BLM movement… when using its existence to try to get a court to rule they can meet.
The protests for Black Lives Matter are not a tool for those needing political angles to seem relevant.
- Dotnonymous -, terribly kind, thank you, my comments as to their importance is still a debatable thing.
Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 2:23 pm
“ When you’ve ceded your seat at the table all you’re left with is victimhood.” - Prudent.
Very well said. “Wow” is done exactly that. Far from being the strong defenders of the Constitution they claim to be, these folks are the very definition of self described victim.
Love it.
Comment by low level Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 3:40 pm
==but protesting in the thousands is good==
Nobody has ever said that. Grow up and argue like an adult.
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 4:41 pm
I guess I should have paid attention more. It’s clear Wow is a drive-by troll.
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 4:43 pm
The real question isn’t “Why was the Governor at a public demonstration against police brutality?” The real question is “Why wasn’t a single Republican elected official at any public demonstration against police brutality?”
As for the GOP claim that it is just standing up for political expression in the face of a pandemic, the countless images of predominantly Black voters forced to stand for hours in gatherings by the hundreds upon hundreds in Milwaukee and Atlanta tell a different story.
The GOP wants to “turn the tables” on Democrats. But the GOP is on the wrong side of history and public sentiment, as the strong turnouts for demonstrations in formerly GOP strongholds show. As long as the GOP insists on making racism the issue, they are only digging a deeper hole. How do they not know this?
Comment by Yellow Dog Democrat Wednesday, Jun 17, 20 @ 5:09 pm